crit cap

[The Crazy Animal]

I agree with what you say about the limitations of the current combat system.  However I don?t think the fix that is need is going to be that simple even in terms of just addressing the scalability.

The biggest problem right now is crit damage is too high. We can?t have higher crit rates till that is addressed. One of the other big problems is damage gain and how quick dmg out paces hp and hp regen gain regardless of healing capabilities because that currently under paces the amount of dmg done per round drastically. There?s also the secondary issue of the number game involved with nothing to cap crits there is nothing to stop a player from having a 100% crit rate. A crit defence in short just becomes another type of variable cap. I can picture the effect ending up being high and higher crit defences for high and higher crit rates and to make matters worse it would probably give the advantage to the heavier armour classes. Even if we then reduce the ac those heavier armour classes get it would just make them hit harder DMG wise when compared in combat cloth vs tank.

This is a very rough idea of how I could see it logically playing out on non-magical armour.

CD = Crit defence
Ratings 9 = high, 1 = low (keep in mind this is a very abstract rating)

Robes ? 9 AC, 1 DR, 1 CD
Padded/Ninja ? 8 AC, 2 DR, 2 CD
Soft Leather ? 7 AC, 3 DR, 3 CD
Soft Stud Leather - 6 AC, 4 DR, 4 CD
Rigid Leather - 5 AC, 5 DR, 5 CD
Studded Rigid Leather (ringmail) - 4 AC, 6 DR, 6 CD
Chainmail - 3 AC, 7 DR, 7 CD
Scalemail- 2 AC, 8 DR, 8 CD
Platemail - 1 AC, 9 DR, 9 CD

One of the big problems with this is that the DR of the heavier armours could out pace the dmg capabilities of the lighter armour wears. This is something that is a reality of the game right now the only 2 classes that are ultra light armour wearers that have combative talent are mystics and ninjas the rest of them are combat 1. Priests are a little better off then mages when it comes to this because they have access to maces rather then just staffs and daggers.

I really think the way to fix the combat round issues in this is to give players ways of actively defending themselves rather then having all the rounds being purely linear and having a PCs defenses being entirely passive. Being able to ward off an attack via active defense will give a player the ability to regen a little easier and change the tide of combat. I talk about changing how combat rounds work a lot in weapons skills wiki article. Getting to that point should also help magic users to be able to defend themselves better even given their limited combat abilities. Especially in the case of things like staffs which should be made to behave exceedingly efficient in defense to make up for their low attack capabilities.

As far as fixing magical combat so it stands on par with weapon combat that?s going to take a lot more work. I think though that that really needs to move in the direction of offering spells in auto packs that have offensive as well as defensive abilities that go with them. This though is a whole topic in itself.

[DeathCow]

Looks interesting...although  I'm more interested in working on weapon styles first...

[The Crazy Animal]

Getting away from the purely linear combat is at the heart of the weapons skills. I would suggest though that we temporarily remove the crit cap just to see how unbalanced it makes things when we go to implement the weapon skills. That way we are working from a nice blank slate and can fix things according to need rather then after thoughts. oh and roll back the damage on crits too so we can handle it character wise.

[DeathCow]

Remove the crit cap?  Are you insane?

[The Crazy Animal]

Well duh.. Crazy your just figuring that out... lol... Anyway I wasn't talking keeping it off but just while we figure out how to fix it better :)

[Mukami]

I agree that the big problem with crits right now is just how out of balance they are. Your potential damage is so much higher when you look at your high hit being 100 and your high crit being 500. But what throws that off the most is when you add in the 5 swings per round. 500 vs 2500. A quick fix (which i know usally are full of holes or cause problems later) would be to reduce the number of max swings also. Ive always thought that levels simply giving you more swings was a bit of a copout. You could just as easily do a 1 or 2 swing max and have your combat improve in other ways (damage x2 50% --> damage x2.2 53%). Thinking about this also made me feel much better about the mystic. Give them more swings per round (hands and feet moving nearly simultaneous) but have them doing less damage (because your kicking someone wearing a metal leggings) or give them the option for a slower but more powerful jumpkick where they can only do it once or twice per round and they are like the other people fighting.

[El_Jefe]

I was reading all of this.

I like the idea of trading off for greater leftover strength/encumberance leading to more ability to crit.  I know if i swing my axe to chop wood, the less I have hampering me, the more I can cleave the log in half without hitting a knot area.

Only problem is a halfing has no leftover str worth a damn.

Except... if this formula has TWO sides to it.

one of them is something else that gives +crit ability.  I think agility should effect ability to crit a bit like statically, not based upon anything besides the level of agility.  a small amount but any increase in ability to crit is always highly useful.  it balances some tougher builds.  We dont want to see halfings only using certain stuff so they can crit more and being limited in their equipment builds.  a trade off is good and an unusual build is fun so you never want to negate them.

I love: neko and gaunt whunters.  I love halfing mystics/mages and I really love Ogre mages.

those arent good if you play by the rules and the rules work to balance only the perceived pathways of fighters.  halfings wearing light stuff, big guys wearing heavy stuff, or worse, big guys wearing light stuff and havling 90% str left over...