Mob follow behaviors...

[The Crazy Animal]

Grox mentioned in a bug posting:
http://www.greatermud.com/forums/index.php?topic=1296.0

That mob follow behaviors are off a little, In this particular case its about where mobs should follow you. This bug though is part of a broader issue involved in the development of greatermud. So I was wondering what do players want out of mob movements and mob follow behaviors?

I know this is a topic that I have a lot of ideas on but I'd really like to hear from other people first..

If you remember details of mmuds follow behaviors you can include those also so perhaps we can get a list going..

[The Crazy Animal]

Anyone??? lol

[Gazoink]

I believe it adds an element of surprise for the people that have been playing this game from the beginning that they follow where they are not supposed to, but if you look at it another way.  What stops them from following you somewhere?  If there is an actual reason for the thing not to go there, then I can agree, they should not follow.  If it is just that they have never followed there before, then I think this is something we should break away from.  Perhaps we could tie them following into something akin to the tracking ability, and unless (as I said above) there is a reason a particular monster can not enter a room, then let them follow as far as they can track us.

[The Crazy Animal]

Ok I let this sit a little while figuring others might chime in but oh well...

I believe it adds an element of surprise for the people that have been playing this game from the beginning that they follow where they are not supposed to.

Yes it certainly does.

What stops them from following you somewhere?

This is kind of the point of the conversation. In mmud there was no natural boundary to stop mobs from going where they pleased yet they would suddenly stop and stand there waiting. It brings up another good question though which is what are reasonable limits for mobs to follow.

Should mobs:
Be allowed to follow you into town?
Though doors that might be to small?
In and out of paths, holes, and cracks in the walls...?
Be able to unlock via bash or picklocks non-keyed doors?
Follow through exits that require special items (ex rope and grapple, skiff, keys, room ticket)?
Ect...

The ability for mobs to follow anywhere however creates an openning for a new problem what protects players from out of level mobs that wonder into low level areas...? Certainly in towns we could potentially use guards but what about a baby red dragon loose in the slums.. what then?

Perhaps we could tie them following into something akin to the tracking ability, and unless (as I said above) there is a reason a particular monster can not enter a room, then let them follow as far as they can track us.

This is one of the types of things that I would really like to get to eventually. Right now based on the mmud data structure we only have one control for mob follow behavior and Its a very simple random percentage number. The rest of the behavoir of mobs was entirely hardcoded so that every mob acts for the most part the same way.. which is very boring in my opinion and certainly not very challenging.

I know I could say alot more but I'm only trying to encurage the conversation at this point...

[ghaleon]

In mmud there was no natural boundary to stop mobs from going where they pleased yet they would suddenly stop and stand there waiting.

What do you mean there is no boundary in majormud? of course there is a boundary...

That is what monster type is for... Monsters in Group 1 can't pass into Group 2 (beside the majormud bug that lets monsters spawn in odd areas of course). Use slums for instance... Guards in the 'guard' type cant go into the group 1 type in slums.. just like cultists (group 3) cant cross into the orc area (group 1).

[The Crazy Animal]

What do you mean there is no boundary in majormud? of course there is a boundary...

That is what monster type is for... Monsters in Group 1 can't pass into Group 2 (beside the majormud bug that lets monsters spawn in odd areas of course). Use slums for instance... Guards in the 'guard' type cant go into the group 1 type in slums.. just like cultists (group 3) cant cross into the orc area (group 1).

I suppose natural boundary could be misleading if you didn't really want to think into it much... I'm was speaking more to the effect of a natural or man made obstacle that impedes the ability to move from area to area. Such an obstacle that a player may pass, over, under, around, or through but leaves a NPC or Mob stuck on the other side with a measure of believability's to it. Rather then an invisible line in the proverbial sand such as that which is currently controlled via spawn based index groupings. Think wall, fence, gate, cliff, river.....

Think about the cultists and orcs as two national populations occuping the same land mass... Kind of similar the the whole US mexico boarder thing if you know what I mean.... Now if we were talking about lawful good mobs I'd say sure they can see that spray painted boarder line and they won't crossover... And it would be believeable to some degree that a lawful good mob would follow those established rules. However were talking about chaotic evil mobs that attack on site and follow until they get bored, die, or kill you... Is it in character for them to stop and stand at some fictional line in the sand; dumfounded and wait for you to come back to them as you continue to run away. No it makes no sense whatsoever... That to me is not a believeable behavior for that type of mob to have at a boarder crossing.

Is that clearer in meaning?

[manihooni]

found these guys just a few rooms from under town square
Sewer Tunnel
You notice club here.
Also here: guardsman, elite guardsman, elite guardsman, elite guardsman, elite
guardsman.
Obvious exits: east, west

roflmao

[DeathCow]

I wish Ghaleon had not used guards in his example, the guard type mobs have special movement rules.

[ghaleon]

I wish Ghaleon had not used guards in his example, the guard type mobs have special movement rules.

Sorry, but you understood what I was getting at.

Yes I like the idea of the whole 'tracking' thing but could that lead to abuse? I also thing mobs SHOULD be able to roam into town, but guards should also attack those monsters..

I hate when I see this:

Also here: happy guardsman, acid slime.

[The Crazy Animal]

Also here: happy guardsman, acid slime.

But thats why the guardsman is so happy... His little slimer gives him so much joy when it eats the little kids that run around town that normal bother him to no end.

....

How would Mobs tracking players lead to abuse? I'm just not seeing where you're coming from here... I mean if they are tracking you... How does that effect others or let you gain some advantage???

[DeathCow]

It would lead to high level players dragging high level monsters into areas where lower level players are scripting.

[The Crazy Animal]

And I assume they are just going to sit around and not track you when you try to leave the area to leave them there..?