Ninjas & Mystics

[The Crazy Animal]

I was thinking it might be interesting to change the ninjas a little and make them a little similar to mystic by giving them some type of combative magic, which focuses on the use of their weapon skills. My main thought is to have ninjas more offensive and mystics more defensive and to have them seem a little more developed.

To start, I don?t know if anyone here is familiar with the cartoon called Naruto but basically it?s a cartoon about ninjas. Borrowing a little on the Naruto Plot theme, I thought it would be interesting to have 5 ninja fractions that share power across the realm each of the fractions have some unique abilities that players could learn. So the basic character creation would have a starting point were the players would pick up some basic skills then as the player progresses (s)he would be recruited into one of the fractions and the power struggles that lay between them.

Classical Japanese Mystical Elements:
Earth, Water, Fire, Wind, Void
Ki: energy force ? similar to Chinese Chi or Qi

The individual magical abilities are called Jutsu, which translates to mean skill in English.

Some brief examples of possible Jutsu:
Fire Blade Jutsu: would add a chance fire spell to each successful weapon strike. Water Walk Jutsu: might let a player negate the need of a raft. Sand Storm Jutsu might have a slight slow effect.
Hidden Mist Jutsu: might allow the user to vanish from combat by forcing a break combat and hide for a high cost since it would be a powerful ability.
Ice Shield Jutsu: might allow a minor spell reflect chance
Ice needle Jutsu: would cause icicle like darts to be thrown at an opponent
Lightning Strike Jutsu: might cause a chance lightning stike per successful weapon strike.
Under toe Jutsu: would cause a chance at nocking an opponent of their feet.
Thunder Clap Jutsu: might cause a chance for a dazing strike on an opponent.

I was also trying to work this concept into revamping the Mystics too I was thinking we could model there combative magic after the Chinese mystical theme since kai as used by mmud is a fictional word and not really used anywhere else that I have found. 

Chinese mystical elements:
Wood, Fire, Earth, Metal, Water
Chi: energy force

The other thing that I would really like to see is an expansion on the current martial arts system. I was thinking that it would be interesting to have combat move sets so that players with the martial arts skill might learn different styles. Each style would include a few moves that develop over the course of game play.

TCA

[Bong]

More and more I wonder if I'm going to want to play gmud. If I want something this in-depth, I can just log back onto aardwolf mud and play with 500 other people.

This isn't bashing on you, animal. I've just been caught off-guard by the difference of posts here, from what I had read on forumshq. I thought the idea was to recreate mmud in a manner that would allow for better updates/progress. Not make a completely new mud, like the other 1000's out there.

[The Crazy Animal]

It?s ok Bong I understand what you?re saying. From what I understand, this is going to be a mud engine that has the look and feel of majormud as far as interface and with minor tweaking can made to be an exact clone. However, for legal purposes the content that it is released with cannot be an exact clone.

Saying that I know I suggest some outlandish stuff if you were to look at it in the confines of just being a majormud clone. As we all know, majormud was never designed to go, much past level 50 when it was first developed due to this there are many things that happen that are detrimental to game play. So I really look at this project as the possibility to fix many if not all of those problems that were inherent in the original mmud engine as well as improving on some of the content shortcomings. 

Getting back on the thread topic though, didn?t you ever feel the ninjas were just thrown in as a replacement class? They never really got much by way of items, back-story. How about the mystics stuck with severely limited weapons, and the same three martial arts moves for the entire course of the game. How boring is it to still be jump kicking when your level 70 and have only gotten what 23 kai powers over the course of the game for your lovely 250% exp table?

TCA

[Ice_Hole]

You know, Mystic may have 23 different powers, but I use a total of 3 or 4 of them.  That is it, unless i am trying to 10 spell.  So more powers is kinda useless.

What about other classes, mage/ priest for instance.  The Priest gets a LOT of spells, and whatnot.  You know I have never actually killed a monster with my lvl 55 priest using a spell?  Not unless I was nekked!  You know, all I use are buff spells, and heals?  So I have all these "good" spells that I don't even use.  Mage, same thing.  You use your best attack, and best room spell.  Sure that varies going up the ranks.  It is one spell then another.  But when it comes to a scripting game, who wants to keep track of 500 different spells?

Only way to make something like this truely be useful, is create certain instances where each spell use useful.  Kinda like a druid, and some mage spells.  If mobs have resistances to certain thing, you don't use thoes wpells on them, and instead use other spells, even if they are lower lvl.  Or you use different spells if they have - resistance to something.

In the end, you could put in 500 different mystic powers.  And only 3 or 4 of them would be used.  Unless you have users HAVE to choose.

What is you were to integrate different attack types.  Say something from DnD, fists of fury, an attack that does more swings, less damage, and more acc.  THEN make people have to chose these attacks as part of a quest/ alignment.  Or have an attack of the bear, a few less swings, more damage, and less acc.  The way this would work, if you pick fists of fury, you would end up doing less damage over all, unless the mobs had high ac/dodge.  In which case, bear would not be as powerful.  But that takes some intense plannaing and balanceing within a game.  The current system works, but you end up with 3 or 4 spells or powers you use all the time, the rest sit there, never being used.  When was the last time you used explodeing fist with a mystic?

- Ice_Hole

[The Crazy Animal]

Many spells in mmud don?t get used simply because they are inefficient to script with. Many spells don?t get used because they don?t have the content in place to support their usefulness. Finally many more don?t get used because they are designed to fade in their usefulness. I could continue to spout off the reasons why spells don?t get used but what it really comes down to is every player has their own style of play so they deserve the diversity that would allow them to further investigate their playing style over the course of the game and continually refining it. This is something that I would really like to see happen with this.

In developing, the system for ninjas and mystics it is the players choice over the development of their character is the primary objective. For the ninjas, I think this could be done with the 5 fractions since, each of those individual fractions have unique styles and Jutsu. So, the first decision of this is making players have to choose one of those fractions. From there they take on the further decisions of alignment and its additional modifications and possibly race to what type of Jutsu that they would get.

I mentioned earlier that I would like to see the martial arts skill developed into a functional system I was thinking of modeling it after kung-fu. Each style has unique moves some slower some more powerful and this is the type of thing that need to be worked into the system. However, I think it would be interesting to have the names of the styles named after things in the game so you might have, Filthbug Style, Manticore Style, Roc Style, Yeti Style, Hydra Style?. Each style would have unique attacks that relate to it.

Just as you mentioned that, the flaws of the current system make it so that a player ends up just settling on a couple of powers in the game this is something that I would really like to avoid having happen. To avoid this I think there needs to be a crossover point where magical spells and their physical combat skills are combinable to some extent so that players have a uniqueness to explore between pairing them up and continually experimenting to find better moves as they gain powers and attacks.

To make a brief example I?ll use one of the attacks that you mentioned ?Fists of Fury? used in conjunction with say a ?Fire Jutsu? might become ?Blazing Fists of Fury? while the same attack with a ?Water Jutsu? might become ?Tidal Fists of Fury?. The physical combat aspect would add in the combat mechanics of say less swings or more damage or high chance of critical hits while the influence of the Jutsu would have secondary effects that present the move with further uniqueness. I think the same thing can be used to have different weapon attacks for the ninjas.

TCA

[Bong]

... The current system works, but you end up with 3 or 4 spells or powers you use all the time, the rest sit there, never being used.  When was the last time you used explodeing fist with a mystic?

It must have been the last time I was cybering this hawtie d-elf thief. I went to fist her, and next thing I knew she was dead. :(

I like your points regarding the narrowing usefulness of spells, Ice. I posted something that briefly touches on this in the spells section of this forum, if you get a sec check it out and post your thoughts.

EDIT: Because TCA posted first, added quote.

[The Crazy Animal]

It defiantly makes more sense with the quote the first time I read it I was like, ?what the hell is that supposed to mean.?

I agree with Ice_hole that spells need to have a content related usefulness or they don?t really serve much sense in being in the game other than for powers sake. However, at the same time I look at it from the point of what is more fun to play a character that has very little replay value or a character that is faced with many options to explore that determine the development of its powers.

TCA

[DeathCow]

Ninja spells....um..no.  Although I wouldn't mind having some of the prestige ninja classes use spells.

[The Crazy Animal]

Grin well I figured it would be a highly debatable subject. What about using a system like this for just the mystics?

TCA

[DeathCow]

Well I guess it depends alot on how crazy the mystic story arcs go.  I know I'm gonna let people stylize their martial arts, but I don't know about a cosmic struggle.  Of course to respond well to this thread I'd need to go through and hit each point.  At this point its like 4 am, so oo water...brb.

yummy.

Oo yeti style...

[The Crazy Animal]

I figured it might be an ideal time in this post to spoof some verbal kung-fu fighting move names like; Giant Rat chews through shield (you lose 5 AC)! Followed by: Roc's claw snatches sheep (you take 50 damage)! Drunken Yeti belches loudly (you feel sick)! Giant spider spins his web (you can?t move)! Followed by: Angry Manicore smashes foe (you take 35 damage)! Evil Silverfish knocks the raft (you fall down!) Clumsy Swamp Troll Flings the muck (You can?t see)!

Currently how do you see having the mystics/Ninjas and their skills fitting into the realm? Are you thinking based on Shaolin Monks and Oriental Assassins or more along the lines with themes out of the Wuxia fantasy genre and its offshoots?

All jokes aside, I?ve been trying to guess at stuff that might be able to work into what you have in mind from the little hints at stuff your say you want or are doing. However, it really would be easier if we had some type of list of things you?re looking for? Maybe a little more information on the storyline and plot, some things you think need to be fixed or reworked, or things you think mmud was lacking.

TCA

[Reece]

Just a humble thought. All the ideas are wonderful, but if everything you want is put in the game becomes work. You can only add so much before it becomes bulky and unplayable. That is one of mmuds greatest successes. It is simple to play and smooth. When you add too much people become fustrated and stop playing.

[DeathCow]

I'm well aware of mmud successes.   as few as they are.  Have faith.  I think that this game needs to be simple, fun, and accessable.  Thats what intend to preserve from mud, regaurdless of the costs.

[The Crazy Animal]

I must admit that I don't expect everything I post to go in, I'm just a bored insomniac with not much to do... hence the number of posts. When you can't sleep you have to find something to do to keep the mind from going stale.

Besides I trust DC can filter though my manic thoughts and find the pearls.

TCA

[DeathCow]

Right, thats why I tend to say things like "I like that" or "I don't know" or "It needs more thought" or "WT Flying F"....

Or at least i say how I feel about it.  If its a more complex idea I tend to respond to the ideas that I like and ignore the others...Few things get posted that don't need some work.  Lots of ideas are dependant on others.  I think i make that obvious.   Me saying I like an Idea doesnt mean its moved to the top of my must be implemented list..its just means I like it.


Things need to be simple...if we are talking about a specific idea..like lets say auction houses..sire they are new..but the idea is simple...if we are talking about enchancing MA to include 120 different attacks..ok I like that but clearly no..thats not gonna be a mud thing.

I'm a mudder.

The people that will play this game are mudders.

I intend to make mudders happy. <intend>

No bjs.

Unless its for me.

And shes hot.

Or I'm drunk.

Ok, I could be high.